You know, for whoever is still following this, I have to say that I’m not making my comments in a vacuum. Although I am BY NO MEANS an expert on what black women feel about interracial dating or the IR disparity, I’ve read many blogs about the topic, and I’ve read good books on the subject, such as Stolen Women by Dr. Gail Elizabeth Wyatt. In Stolen Women, Dr. Wyatt specifically addresses many of the sexual come-ons that black women hear. Malcolm X spoke about the same thing in his autobiography. I know there’s a lot of truth behind these come-ons because I myself have heard White guys and Asian guys talk about this kind of sexual attraction towards black women.

As you mention, King, the statistics back up this discrepancy between White men who sexual desire black women and White men who are not willing to marry black women. The discrepancy isn’t nearly as big with White men who are attracted to Asian women. It’s totally not fair, but the anti-black stigma is there. It also says NOTHING about black women’s desirability as sexual partners or wives, rather it says something about how mainstream culture marginalizes black women.

My latest statements on the FF post, as King mentions, go way back to the early days of the 44s. By discussing this topic again and again and again with people, more people, and even more people of various races and stages in life, I’ve learned quite a bit about the topic. Here’s some of what we went through:

http://www.thefighting44s.com/archives/2007/08/10/browns-wall-of-shame-in-inter-racial-dating/

Point is, after years of discussing this, I really don’t think “Well, if people of my race won’t date me, then I’ll just head to greener pastures” is a complete solution for most people. Sure, it may help one find companionship, but it doesn’t help fix the general problem that exists in society as a whole. You’ll notice that most of the people who use the “greener pastures” solution tend to harbor quite a bit of hatred towards the opposite gender of their race because of the rejections/injuries they have received. Can people live in peace without resolving these rejections/injuries? The FF pairing, while helpful to individuals, doesn’t address the injury born by large parts of society. That’s what I’d like to fix.

Having read Jaehwan way back to the days of 44s, I feel that I’ve come to understand not only his viewpoints on certain issues, but also the rhetorical environment in which many of these viewpoints were formulated. I’m not sure that it is always fully appreciated that arguments made are often continuations of things previously considered and discussed elsewhere. In regard to Asian guys/Black girls, that is a subject that Byron both discussed and endorsed (on the 44s) as one possible and positive step in the march of progressive racial/sexual relations. However, that opinion was informed by a process of debate that brought to light a certain understanding about how Black women and Asian women are BOTH sexualized (as minority women) but in very different ways. It’s in light of this backdrop that Jaehwan was making his point.

Asian women are sexualized primarily based on the Orientalist meme. That understanding defines Asian women as uber feminine [especially since Orientalism even attempts to define Asian men as feminine.] Asian women are seen as being more compliant, and submissive to men, based on the belief that Asian cultures are both hierarchal and patriarchal. Asian women are perceived as loyal to a fault, owing to the emphasized role of honor and duty, fundamental in so many Asian cultures. Asians, in general, are also seen as being very polite and respectful of tradition. Physically, Asian women are characterized as petite, pretty, and doll like, having long, dark and shiny hair. Oh, and they also smile a lot.

Is that stereotype true? Is it fair? No! It’s a mix of some generalized truths blended with a multitude of even more generalized errors and assumptions which produces a flat, one-size-fits-all stereotype. It’s insulting and belittling, BUT it’s the type of stereotype that many men want to marry. A pretty, submissive, Asian doll, who will consider it her duty to wash his socks, cook his meals, and raise the kids.

Conversely, Black women are sexualized quite differently. Black women are seen as uninhibited, primal, and earthy. It is supposed that Black women are sexually aggressive, wild, voracious in appetites, and athletic in execution. Black women are seen as fiery and strong-willed, quick to anger, and ruled by powerful emotion. Black women are often seen as something exotic to try sexually, but as far too volatile, headstrong, and aggressive, to actually marry. However, what may surprise some, is how many overt and embarrassing offers Black girls get from men of other ethnicities who are looking for an unrestrained and aggressive sexual encounter, that they believe Black women can provide.

Now, is that stereotype true? Is it fair? Of course not! There are as many demure, shy, petite, principled, and intelligent, Black women out there as there are in any other ethnicity. But that’s the way stereotypes work—anyone you meet who doesn’t fit it is a “exception” to the established rule. You just need to look harder.

BOTH sexualized stereotypes are imposed by the majority male culture. Both are harmful to the minority women who fall under them, albeit in different ways. In one case, a woman may find herself married to a jerk who desires her based on some Orientalist notion or Asian subjugation. In the other case, a woman may find herself the object of fleeting but exotic desire to tame the sexual primitive. Both ideas are repressive and insulting. There is no valuation of one being any better than the other. It was in this context that Jaehwan was making his comments about White guys not wanting to marry Black women at the same rate as Asian women above. (which is a statistical fact).

P.S.
* It’s obvious that just as not everyone falls under these stereotypes, neither does everyone believe them or act upon them. There are White men who marry both Asian and Black women with honest motives, and unimpaired judgement.

(it’s the only path to meaningful reform)

Merry, I just looked at that FlashForward post. In the post, I specifically mentioned that I know ASIAN guys who prefer black women. And in case you misinterpret, I know these guys personally–I don’t just know OF them. Some of them happen to be good friends. So I don’t know what your issue is. Men being attracted to black women is not the least bit surprising to me.

lol! you must elevate yourself and asian women so high and feel the need to spit on black women so bad that you would ask such an inane, dumb question.

I’m not sure why you think saying that black women face marital discrimination is somehow “spitting” on them. Wow. I don’t know what to say, other than it’s not always about you. Or me, for that matter.

Would it make you feel better if I said that Black women and Asian women face the same stigma and stereotypes in society? Would it be better to say that Neutral Observer and uRB4N face the same stereotypes as black men and Asian men? And if I said that all cultures are alike, so there is no need to exchange information across cultures? Do you really believe that?

Neutral plainly makes his case here:

http://www.bigwowo.com/2010/02/where-the-black-man-is-kingflashforwards-ir-pairing/#

I reply to Neutral several posts down the thread. In my opinion, Neutral has been much more negative toward Black women than jaehwan has, yet you didn’t react to his post. Why is that, I wonder?

my last post here…

do you think there are white men who don’t face social stigma when considering marrying an asian woman?

lol! you must elevate yourself and asian women so high and feel the need to spit on black women so bad that you would ask such an inane, dumb question.

why do i care that there are some white men who may feel a social stigma from being with a black woman? i don’t want them nor would i want an asian man who doesn’t have the balls to approach me.

evidently, you accept the order. i’ve known white guys who wouldn’t go near an asian woman, ever. believe it or not – there are many white guys like that. conversely, i’ve known white men who prefer black women to asian women – imagine that. i know that’s weird for you because you so clearly believe black women are lowly. and please don’t use some study or “news” article to try to justify what you’re saying – it’s really nothing more than a way to rationalize your true thoughts and ideas.

it’s funny the few black dudes who post here can’t quite see through your little charade. they don’t get that by making your underhanded remarks about black women, you also attack them – black men. but then, they are happy you want to emulate macking, playing the dozens, and whatever else you think is “cool” or transferable in “black” culture.

One more thing, merry…you forgot Eric Jacobus and Robert!!! Sheesh, I got brothers of all colors!