This one is all over the news. It looks like they’ve finally taken someone into custody for the Annie Le case. The AP report says:
Police and FBI agents staged a dramatic raid on the home of a Yale University animal research technician on Tuesday, seeking evidence that might tie him to the slaying of a graduate student whose body was found stuffed behind a wall in a campus research building.
No charges were filed against 24-year-old Raymond Clark III in Middletown, but police took him into custody while searching for DNA and other physical evidence. Police said Clark would be released after they obtain evidence they need from him and his Middletown apartment.
I was surprised it took so long to take decisive action, but I’m glad they finally did. It looks like they were holding back in order to get the facts right. A female Yale student was killed in 1998, and perhaps they were being cautious in order to make sure their suspects didn’t slip through the cracks. Hopefully they’ll catch the person who did this.
No related posts.
But here is an...
I agree with everything you said. About #1…I think...
Just want to make this comment before anyone else does….
This case has nothing to do with race. This is a case is most likely of crazy guy killing a woman who he could not have.
Had she been white or anything else, the same thing would have happened.
Jealous controlling nen kill women all the time.
Also if she had a relationship with him or not also doesn’t matter (and there is no evidence she did, and again even if she did whocares).
Also the police didn’t take that long to get someone. She was only found on Saturday. It takes time to analyze evidence and watch hours of video and look in to the pool of people who could have done it. Its a huge thing to arrest someone for murder with the whole country watching. You don’t want to mess that up.
I am glad they took someone into custody, but the latent message I think the coverage of Annie Le sends is our society values the upper class still.
There are poor women who are abused, kidnapped and killed and it doesn’t garner the attention when a beautiful, educated, bride-to-be disappears.
I followed the Annie Le reports and I don’t care much for anything on the news. I felt for this woman and I feel for her family. I can only speculate the motive for the killing was jealousy and I do believe race and gender may be a part of Raymond Clark III.
At first blush, it seems he may have been jealous that an Asian woman is smarter than him. I also think she might have rejected his advances. Sociopathic tendancy which came to fruition. I think he saw someone where he thought he should be and decided to do away with her.
Her height and weight were probably a factor. He probably thought he could get away with it because she is tiny.
That is just my take on it.
Oh my. Aznheartthrob just sent me this:
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/09/17/nyregion/17yale.html?hp
“Mr. Clark graduated from Branford High School in Branford, Conn., and he appears first in the 2004 yearbook as a member of the Asian Awareness Club. He is photographed next to two women of Asian descent. The club, according to the yearbook, made egg rolls for a faculty luncheon and raised money for a trip to Chinatown for the Chinese New Year in 2004.”
I think there’s going to be more coming out of this. He’s innocent until proven guilty, of course, but he did invoke his right to a lawyer during his initial questioning. I’m thinking that something will come out of this.
Lingyai,
Good point about the timing. With the internet, I think we all just have a pumped up expectation of on-demand–I want to know, and I want to know NOW!
You just had to know that it wasn’t going to be your typical, run of the mill “kill a fellow female, Asian worker at the lab and bury her body behind a wall in the basement” story. What the fuck set the killer off? I thought the killer currently has a girlfriend? Whatever the sick, twisted, perverted motives were and whatever other facts do become disclosed, this is all just speculation for now. But if the guy is arrested and more details are revealed, do you think this can be prosecuted as a hate crime or some variant of? And do you think this aspect of the case can ever be covered adequately by mainstream media?
“Mr. Clark graduated from Branford High School in Branford, Conn., and he appears first in the 2004 yearbook as a member of the Asian Awareness Club. He is photographed next to two women of Asian descent. The club, according to the yearbook, made egg rolls for a faculty luncheon and raised money for a trip to Chinatown for the Chinese New Year in 2004.”
The odds of Clark being a rice chaser just increased.
He’s definitely innocent until proven guilty, but there’s A LOT of facts that don’t cast a favorable light on him, the most damning being a past history of abuse in a relationship – he was almost charged by the police as a high school in a case of harassment with an ex-girlfriend, who also claims that he forced her to have sex with him.
In the case of Le’s murder, you also have to factor in the physical details of the fact that Clark is an ex-baseball player / football player, and Le was only a 4’11, 90 pound girl. It doesn’t take a big stretch of the imagination to see that a physical match-up favors Clark, and Le’s cause of death (strangulation) also makes the scratch marks / bruises found on Clark HIGHLY suspicious.
That NY Times quote really disturbed me.
I was trying to hold off judgment and not think of Le’s murder as the result of a possible racial fetish when Clark was named a “person of interest.” But I think it’s our responsibility to raise these questions; the legal system definitely doesn’t. The average American doesn’t see anything problematic about racial fetishes and won’t think of it as a possible motive in this murder, especially since Le’s fiance was white. I can almost hear it now: “He liked Asians! And she liked white people! He was just crazy and she just happened to be in the lab.”
Yeah,
Rice chasers usually come with some bad issues. I don’t know why. Guys with black preferences or Ukranian preferences seem somewhat normal to me. But rice chasahs? We could go down the list of rice chasing crazies, and I’d probably run out of bandwidth.
About her fiance–a lot of people disagree with me, but I’m taking the position that her fiance Jonathan Widawsky is half Asian. Check out these pics:
http://www.cbsnews.com/elements/2009/09/11/crimesider/photoessay5303665_1_17_photo.shtml?tag=page
http://www.cbsnews.com/elements/2009/09/11/crimesider/photoessay5303665_1_14_photo.shtml?tag=page
http://www.columbia.edu/~lv2117/images/widawsky.jpg
He definitely looks hapa to me. So hopefully that somewhat protects the poor woman against internet flaming…
The boyfriend looks pretty “white” to me….but anyway, its not even about who she dated, rather its about the guy that did this.
If it was a race fetish and he did kill her, does that constitute a hate crime in the U.S? ~ if he targeted her because of her race (because he’s asiaphile and shes asian), does that make it a race hate crime?
Bull carp! This has nothing to do with race being the movtive. It dose not matter if Clark had did it to a white, Hispanic or even a black woman for that matter, it was just sexual in nature. Crying hate crimes all time, dose not help anything. He clearly love Asian women.
I know that some of you will use this incident as rally cry to wail against interracial pairing, but I don’t think it will stop anything.
Because it’s just one incident out of a thousands happily married asian females and White males.
In about six month, this will all be forgotten. I will continue to date Asain women without any problem.
One more thing, Jonthan Widawaky is clearly white—someone can’t identifie if a person is of his race.
Jaehwan said:
He definitely looks hapa to me. So hopefully that somewhat protects the poor woman against internet flaming…
Thats a scary statement, its like saying
if her fiance is hapa = terrible tragedy
if her fiance is white = she deserved it
I know that is not what you mean and you are saying that other people will think that way, its just sad some hateful people will.
There are a ton of speculation, but one source says he was mad at her because of the way she treated the rats/mice in the lab. I kid you not. That she later sent him and email apologizing for it, the police found this on her compute (maybe she just did it for the issue to go away, not that she really felt she did anything wrong because clearly he is crazy if he did murder her).
So it could end up to be a killing partly based on PETAish grounds.
(though it could be the more conventional male obsession with a woman )
Lingyai,
“I know that is not what you mean and you are saying that other people will think that way, its just sad some hateful people will.”
The bloggers have been civil, but some of the commenters haven’t. Look at this commenter from TMM’s site:
http://minoritymilitant.blogspot.com/2009/09/pondering-murder-investigation.html?showComment=1253065108276#c4228298854303212928
“Her fiance ain’t no damn hapa. He’s about as close to being the whitebread overpriveleged twit poster boy as you can get.
Militant, I think you’re right on the money. She was whoring around on the side with a prof or another student, then went up to the lab to call it off since she was getting married. The dude couldn’t take it and so he killed her, and there’s your story. That’s the reason the police are withholding so much information = because they don’t want the fact of her whoring around embarrassing and further upsetting the families involved.
I love how everyone is trying to paint such a sweet innocent picture of this woman. Come on, people. She was marrying for the money and White Status, and whoring it up on the side. It couldn’t be more obvious.”
I don’t know who I feel sorrier for–the poor woman who is being maligned, or the poor commenter who is so consumed by hatred that he needs to publicly insult this murdered woman.
By the way, just so people know where I stand, I think it’s fine to criticize the disparity. The disparity sucks, and we Asian men often get dragged around by its proponents. In that sense, I agree with the gist of what Urb4n says–related to just the idea of the disparity, or course. When it devolves into attacking an innocent individual who you don’t know, however, that’s really unfortunate. That’s taking it too far.
The Times is also saying that it’s a workplace thing. They say there was no romantic connection between the two:
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/09/18/nyregion/18yale.html?_r=1
As for whether it’s a rice chaser fetish thing, we’ll see. According to the Times, “Chief Lewis would not say whether she had been sexually assaulted.” So there still is more to come.
Homeboy ain’t hapa.
For the record, I have enabled comment moderation for the time being.
Hey TMM,
Ooops…for the record, I wasn’t criticizing your moderation policy, just criticizing the comments from “Jackass Sam” (haha…Sylvie, that cracked me up!). Keep up the good work on your blog!
“Bull carp! This has nothing to do with race being the movtive. It dose not matter if Clark had did it to a white, Hispanic or even a black woman for that matter, it was just sexual in nature. Crying hate crimes all time, dose not help anything. He clearly love Asian women.”
Look who crawled out of his hole. Seigfried, the rice-chaser reject from the Fighting44s.
If police accounts are right, your boy Raymond Clark brutally strangled Annie Le to death, as she clawed and fought for her life. Afterwards, Clark tried to hide Le’s body by stuffing it in a wall of a university research facility.
Such is your Asianophile definition of “love.”
David Berkowitz and Ted Bundy would certainly feel you big time.
It seems that the media have been “suggesting” two possible motives by mentioning: 1) the Asian Club to which he belonged in high school or college and 2) his love for his dog, his job description as a lab tech for animal research, and recent email tiff he had with Le regarding her research methods.
I wouldn’t be surprised if the motive ended up being animal research related (“work place violence”) and not sexual or personal motive. This is not a generalization of all Asian scientists doing animal research – but I’ve noticed, in my work, that many of the research subject protection measures including ethical animal research protocols that are in place are often met with blatant rejection. When confronted with a disciplinary action for violation of research ethics, I’ve often heard Asian (especially recent immigrants) researchers say, “Fine, we’ll follow these rules… but they’re just animals and research is more important for human kind.”
Of course, I’m not saying that there aren’t other races or nationalities who feel this way. However, I’ve talked to animal lab techs who progressively form negative feelings toward Asian researchers for their continued disregard for humane treatment of research animals. I don’t know if it’s just a cultural thing? I know that my mom has laughed at my sister for treating her cats like “humans” and buying “special” food for them… and she’s kicked them out of her way much to my brother-in-law’s dismay!
Sorry, I digressed…
Anyway. I know that other blog sites have latched on to that allure of us Asian women that drive white men into homicide… I’m not saying that there aren’t some legitimate reasons for that theory but, as an Asian woman, I can’t help flinch when Asian men are the ones automatically assuming: Asian woman engaged to a white man murdered by a white man = Asian woman’s a ho whose only (un)redeeming quality is her “exotic” allure. It is very possible that she was an unethical researcher who pissed off a deranged fanatic PETA member.
Do we really need fellow Asians perpetuating that stereotype of Asian women?
Jaehwan said:
About her fiance–a lot of people disagree with me, but I’m taking the position that her fiance Jonathan Widawsky is half Asian. Check out these pics.
Nope. He looks Jewish to me. I have absolutely no idea where you’re getting this notion that he’s Hapa.
Rice chasers usually come with some bad issues. I don’t know why. Guys with black preferences or Ukranian preferences seem somewhat normal to me. But rice chasahs? We could go down the list of rice chasing crazies, and I’d probably run out of bandwidth.
Yup. Add this latest tragedy to the growing list of incidents involving creeps with Asian fetish.
I’m not saying that there aren’t some legitimate reasons for that theory but, as an Asian woman, I can’t help flinch when Asian men are the ones automatically assuming: Asian woman engaged to a white man murdered by a white man = Asian woman’s a ho whose only (un)redeeming quality is her “exotic” allure.
It’s called “blowback”.
@ mama nabi
The “animal cruelty” angle can’t be totally ruled out, of course, but why would someone who would be so upset by “animal mistreatment” work in a lab where they experiment on animals?
It’s like, what… “Treat that mouse nicely… between his weekly CANCER injections?”
I think that the probability of a person who would be willing to kill another person over the mistreatment of lab rodents would work in a place where they ruotinely kill lab rodents is low.
Ah. Yes, but we’re supposed to treat them ethically while we inject them with cancer.
Trust me, I’ve heard animal facility technicians go OFF in screaming matches over unethical treatment of the animals. They cannot be in any undue pain. They also have to be euthanized humanely and swiftly.
I’ve know many animal lover who are “willing” to work in research labs because they get to make sure that, although research is being done to them, the animals are treated with utmost pampering. Between the deadly disease injections and eventual euthanasia, of course.
“blowback”? Hah. Really? And who’s to say Asian women dating outside their race isn’t also “blowback”? My mom who’s wringing her hands because I’m dating a Korean man – I’m sure she’d be interested in hearing the “blowback” theory.
“blowback”? Hah. Really? And who’s to say Asian women dating outside their race isn’t also “blowback”?
Nope. That’s what we call a stereotype and a cliche, richly deserving of parody and satirical commentary.
mama nabi said:
I wouldn’t be surprised if the motive ended up being animal research related (”work place violence”) and not sexual or personal motive. This is not a generalization of all Asian scientists doing animal research – but I’ve noticed, in my work, that many of the research subject protection measures including ethical animal research protocols that are in place are often met with blatant rejection. When confronted with a disciplinary action for violation of research ethics, I’ve often heard Asian (especially recent immigrants) researchers say, “Fine, we’ll follow these rules… but they’re just animals and research is more important for human kind.”
I agree with this, recent immigrants and those not born in America generally are less concerned with the animals and more concerned with the research. I would say this is a pragmatic view and one I share. I am not cheering to have rats or monkeys be inject with cancer causing agents but hey if it help humans avoid or reduce cancer in the future I am all for it. Its not like it is cosmetic research.
mama nabi said:
I wouldn’t be surprised if the motive ended up being animal research related (”work place violence”) and not sexual or personal motive. This is not a generalization of all Asian scientists doing animal research – but I’ve noticed, in my work, that many of the research subject protection measures including ethical animal research protocols that are in place are often met with blatant rejection. When confronted with a disciplinary action for violation of research ethics, I’ve often heard Asian (especially recent immigrants) researchers say, “Fine, we’ll follow these rules… but they’re just animals and research is more important for human kind.”
Wow. You sound just like White people when the incident between the cop and Harvard Prof Henry Louis Gates, Jr happened, trying to explain it away with everything and anything but plain old simple racism. We don’t even know if the perp belongs to any animal right organization or if he even has a history of being concerned with animal rights. Meanwhile, this:
“Mr. Clark graduated from Branford High School in Branford, Conn., and he appears first in the 2004 yearbook as a member of the Asian Awareness Club. He is photographed next to two women of Asian descent. The club, according to the yearbook, made egg rolls for a faculty luncheon and raised money for a trip to Chinatown for the Chinese New Year in 2004.”
and the fact that this looks awfully like a crime of passion is totally not relevant at all!
The suspect may not be a formal member of PETA, but police did report that there were exchanges of emails between himself and the victim regarding supposed protocol violations relating to the care of the lab animals.
As much as people would like to speculate rice chasing, hate-crime, etc. the facts thus far released do not reveal anything about a romantic connection, stalking incidents, or even rape. The article reports about his overall “antisocial” behavior towards people in general ESPECIALLY the other graduate students working in the lab.
Yes mama nabi is a huge racist!….(obviously not) She is not trying to explain it away, she is just saying how conflict could happen. People of different cultures can have differing views and this can lead to tension, nothing racist about it. People from Brazil and people from Saudi Arabia are generally going to view the way women should be able to dress differently.
but just because there is conflict doesn’t give you the right to strangle anyone.
If he did kill her, he clearly is a dangerous nut when it comes to treating lab animals.
And the Gates case was more about police power trip then race. There are some cops who don’t like their authority challenged, and if you do so they will show you who is boss, these vindictive thugs don’t care what is legal they just want to have power over people.
Agreed. Mama Nabi is the furthest thing from a racist. I agree with lingyai too on the Gates-Crowley thing. Sometimes it’s race; sometimes it’s not.
“or if he even has a history of being concerned with animal rights.”
ABC News reported that detectives had found texts exchanged between Miss Le and Mr Clark arranging to meet on the day she disappeared. Mr Clark texted her early that morning to ask for a meeting to discuss the cleanliness of the cages of the research mice.
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/ny_crime/2009/09/16/2009-09-16_could_brutal_tale_be_about_mice.html
Sometimes it ISN’T about race or trying to sound like those “white” folks – sometimes it just might be the fact that I’ve worked with researchers, research lab, and work with animal research protocol compliance audits to ensure ethical treatment of research animals and saw the possibility of escalating work-related tensions.
You know, think outside the box, something people with a life are prone to do…?
I concede to your all-knowing awesomeness, big mama. Although I still think this was a crime of passion and not just a misunderstanding about mouse droppings or whatnot. But you’ve stated your case. Although, it must also be said that resorting to ad hominem attack is too easy and a hallmark of someone incapable of civil disagreement.
Actually, there is a small grain of truth when it comes to Asian men being more “prickly.” Yes, I know that it only appears this way but if I’m going to point out the problems of Asian women, it’s only fair for me to do the same to the men.
Now, my question is this: Asian women, doesn’t it feel better to flee the community as soon as you encounter a little bit of hardship rather than couch the men on how to fix the problem?
I mean, we’ve all heard of the Asian women who had one bad experience with Asian men and swear off the community.
Next, have Asian women figured out how they enforce this stereotype?
I dont want to reignite any fires. But look, race doesn’t have to be the prime motivation in any case. Can we agree that motivation can be greatly influenced by the factor of race? Also, the news media tells you what they want to tell you. And the people and interest groups behind the case (Yale, the Jewish boy’s parents, rich kids’ families, etc)tell the media what they want to tell the media or at least greatly influence what the investigators and the mainstream media tells us. So we do not know all the facts, but we can be intelligent enough to understand that nothing is ever black and white. You can bet your ass that race played some part in this case.
As far as the Gates-Crowley case, power trip may be the main motivation but race certainly influenced how Crowley carried out that power trip. For example, it was established that the caller did not identify the race or appearance of the two she thought were breaking into a house. But somehow Crowley stated that the caller said “two black males” with black backpacks on his report. That case was all about race where race was the primary factor.
As a side note, I honestly dont think this case would attract so much media coverage and this kind of coverage if Annie was not scheduled to be marry to a white guy regardless of whether it was at Yale or not. That’s the plain truth. I think MM talked a little about this on his blog. Even non Asians noticed how the media put special focus on her wedding. When was the last time a missing Asian with no ties to whites (spouse, boyfriend, girlfriend, parents) attracted so much media attention? While you keep thinking, the made for tv movie and a two hour long news show about the details of the murder are being planned.
“Actually, there is a small grain of truth when it comes to Asian men being more “prickly.”
Prickly?
Larry:
“If police accounts are right, your boy Raymond Clark brutally strangled Annie Le to death, as she clawed and fought for her life. Afterwards, Clark tried to hide Le’s body by stuffing it in a wall of a university research facility.
Such is your Asianophile definition of “love.”
You’re so off base! I never meant that Raymond Clark loved Annie by killing her. I must have had a brain fart that day.
I’m glad that alot of people are waking up to the fact that this is not a racial thing. It’s just a crazy control freak. There’s hope for you people yet.
It’s a shame that you people few white men like bears in the honey tree. And we are taking your honey. Things just happen that way. Many white men don’t know that Asian men are offended by them dating their women.
Besides, us dating the beauty Asian female should be a compliment of your race.
And with that, many Asian female of all ages are flattered beyond words to have so much attention paid to them.
“Look who crawled out of his hole. Seigfried, the rice-chaser reject from the Fighting44s.”
One more thing, the only reason I got the boot from the fighting 44s was because Ditech and the other guys on the forum was jealous that I was making in roads to Asian female, too bad. “Tokyo Love Story”, “Ike” and “Jade Dragon” was falling for me and that’s why I got the boot. And again I repeat, none of them could never say that they would not categorical date a white men.
“Tokyo Love Story”, “Ike” and “Jade Dragon” was falling for me and that’s why I got the boot.
Yeah.. that’s the reason. Any one of them would tear you a new one, of they read that statement. Give it up, RC.
Greetings!
I guess new details have finally emerged and Raymond Clark has pleaded guilty. In particular, he admits to attempted sexual assault:
http://articles.latimes.com/2011/mar/18/nation/la-na-yale-killing-20110318
I was reminded of this by your newest posting—this new development is pretty recent, although I guess a lot less attention-getting. Such news is depressing and tends to support the racially motivated hypothesis, but it needs to get out there.
I’ve been lurking for a while, and when I get around to it, I’ll perhaps do a more proper introduction of myself. I stumbled upon this site while being curious about Asian American media matters (Akira whitewashing). The IR disparity/rice-chasing phenomenon has affected me quite directly and scarily–both in unwanted advances toward female relatives of mine (I am an Asian male), and someone who has been chasing after my Asian girlfriend–a person who, eerily echoing Clark, tries to \involve\ himself in all sorts of Asian cultural things. He has in fact been booted from various Asian martial arts institutes in the area due to complaints by female members. This isn’t to bag on \legit\ IR pairings of course (in fact said female relative has long recovered and is in fact dating WM). Not to stoke the flames, but for those of you who don’t believe that there’s something real here, let me tell you it is very real, and stories like this as well as the most recent tale linked above are not comforting at all.
cdawg,
Nice to meet you! Thanks for the update. I had no idea that there was a sexual assault that took place.
Sorry to hear about the chasers going after your girlfriend. I’ve seen it before, and I believe it. You really do have to watch out for that kind of thing. That kind of thing is very typical; it’s like they’re so blinded by chaser-ism that they can’t even see straight. This is why I think we need to build up culture and arts.
Yes, please introduce yourself when you have time. Would love to hear about you and your experiences!
bigWOWO,
Good to meet you too. Yeah, the chaser mentality this fellow embodied was especially troubling: he somehow feels entitled to have any Asian girl he likes, and it is apparently my duty to just hand her over. The concept that of us actually being a couple just doesn’t enter his brain, and so he thinks I’m deliberately “hiding” her from him just to be difficult. Perhaps this sort of attitude comes into play in these kinds of incidents—even though, in the case of Annie Le, her fiancé was not fully Asian (I say he looks hapa, too).
Anyway, I hope to be visiting and commenting regularly. All of this has definitely gotten me fired up and made me aware of the need for more activism.
It’s really sad that some guys do this.
Do you guys have mutual friends in common? If so, you might want to get some people to try to convince him to quit chasing rice, or at least leave your girlfriend alone. It’s all cultural, so if his group is against it, he might back off.
@cdawg
“Do you guys have mutual friends in common? ”
I would suggest talking to a lawyer friend, and considering a restraining order.
Even better would be restraining order from multiple Asian women that this white guy is harassing as if its his colonial inheritance. Imagine mass restraining orders against rice-chasers.
“Yeah, the chaser mentality this fellow embodied was especially troubling: he somehow feels entitled to have any Asian girl he likes, and it is apparently my duty to just hand her over.”
These kind of guys are funny. They think that because they eat Chinese food, watch kung fu marathons on T.V., and wear a silk kimono bathrobe, that they can become honorary Asians… like Tom Cruise in The Last Samurai. And of course, they also just LOVE Asian girls, because they all “look like cute little elves or dolls.”
But when you really look at their actions, it becomes clear that they have no respect for Asian people.
1) They expect to be able to be able to easily take an Asian guy’s girlfriend from him.
2) They expect to be seen as a “catch” to all Asian women.
3) They expect to have no trouble being accepted into the community as an “honorary Asian.”
All of this is really an indication of their own belief of ultimate superiority. If they did not fell themselves to be so much better than Asians, they would not make these assumptions.
bigWOWO,
We do have one close mutual friend, and some other mutual acquaintances. The mutual friend has tried to tell him that the mentality is unhealthy, but that just caused him to accuse us of being “in collusion.” The other acquaintances sort of just laugh it off, because they don’t really grasp the depth of the problem (not being Asian themselves, and not knowing just how far he’s tried to get). He seems to have backed off for now (it’s down to occasionally expressing resentment in emails), but I am generally staying on high alert.
John Doe,
That’s an option that I’m considering. I don’t really know what evidence I would need, but I guess that’s what the lawyer is for. That said, I feel like I’m walking a fine line, because, while I want to let him know his actions are not OK, I also don’t want to antagonize him and get him worked up and more angry. I believe he’s gotten some form of warning of the sort from the martial arts places. This caused him to become angry at, in his own words, “the whole Asian community,” accusing us of having a “xenophobic and superior attitude.”
King,
Great point you make about the lack of respect. It describes this guy perfectly: Because he couldn’t get what he wanted from “being interested in Asian culture,” he then proceeds to tar us all with the same brush… turning the tables and saying that we’re the racist ones. Classic demonization of the entire group.
Well, it’s a good thing he’s backed off. I’d be somewhat alert, but if he stays away, eventually he’ll lose interest and go chasing after some other Asian girl. I’ve seen it happen before.
The guy just sounds like an overall weirdo, Asian fetish or not. How did this guy get into your social circle?
He’s another regular at a coffee shop that I go to (that’s where I get most of my studying done). We met a while back, before my current relationship. He had expressed interest in Asian philosophy, had mostly the same political leanings, etc., enough to strike up a decent friendship. It slowly emerged he was a rice-chaser, but even I laughed it off in the beginning, having no idea just how embedded the mentality was. At the time, I had my mind set that the only way to combat the IR disparity was to not restrict myself. But things really clicked with my current girlfriend and I ended up dating an Asian after all… which immediately caused things to go downhill with the guy.
If the dude is blatantly chasing after your girlfriend, he just needs to be cut off cold. Even better is to also have your girl send a clear message for him to f-off, if she hasn’t done so already. No reason why any of you need to even be civil to this dude.
I totally agree with Notty. Nobody likes to deal with drama, but there comes a time when you have to go to war on these things!
Some dude disrespecting you and trying to get at your girlfriend is DEFINITELY a hill you want to fight and die on. And Notty is right about another thing—you guys may have all been friends before, but at this point, your girlfriend has to stop being nice to the dude, and straight out tell him:”
1) “I’m not attracted to you.”
2) “I’m with the guy I want to be with.”
3) “Don’t ask me twice because I didn’t stutter, and I don’t make mistakes”
4) “If you can’t get with that program then don’t bother even talking to me.”
Thanks for your input. Don’t get me wrong, we have pushed back strongly… we just haven’t gotten to the level of an actual restraining order. We ignore and avoid him now, and it does seem to be working. This all has been a real eye-opener, though—it just amazes me how far it’s gone. As I said, even I never really made too much of a deal of rice-chasers before, and he seemed pretty harmless. But this incident shows that there is a lot of ground between mere preference and extremes like the Annie Le and Qian Liu cases, and we still have to fight on, even when those perpetrators have been brought to justice.
Now parents are suing the school:
http://www.cnn.com/2011/CRIME/09/07/connecticut.yale.killing/index.html?iref=NS1
How dumb.
The blame lays with Clark who killed her.
Asian men are still seen as the eunuchs in American society. What people really don’t know is that there are a lot more beta type White men who have given up on the dating/mating scene, all because of the alpha WMs taking most of the desirable WFs. Some of these guys then become race chasers and try to settle down with less desirable Asian women.
“He’s another regular at a coffee shop that I go to (that’s where I get most of my studying done). We met a while back, before my current relationship. He had expressed interest in Asian philosophy, had mostly the same political leanings, etc., enough to strike up a decent friendship. It slowly emerged he was a rice-chaser, but even I laughed it off in the beginning, having no idea just how embedded the mentality was. At the time, I had my mind set that the only way to combat the IR disparity was to not restrict myself. But things really clicked with my current girlfriend and I ended up dating an Asian after all… which immediately caused things to go downhill with the guy”.
What people really don’t know is that there are a lot more beta type White men who have given up on the dating/mating scene, all because of the alpha WMs taking most of the *desirable WFs.*
Ha what is wrong with the above statement?
King,
“Ha what is wrong with the above statement?”
Ok, in the big cities, White beta types have a harder time with their own women. I guess desirable is subjective. But then why would they become rice chasers?
I don’t want to know about Coco Lee and her older rich White guy husband.
Why would they become rice chasers?
Probably a variety of reasons but I’d guess that high among them would be:
1) Some think their nerdiness / looserness will be lost in translation with an Asian girl
2) Some are just following the herd and chasing a fad.
3) Some have a long list of stereotypes in their heads and that attract them.
* Rice Chaser: a White guy who chases ONLY after Asian women because of their delicious “Asianess.”
“Asian men are still seen as the eunuchs in American society. What people really don’t know is that there are a lot more beta type White men who have given up on the dating/mating scene, all because of the alpha WMs taking most of the desirable WFs. ”
Black women are the least married group, after that the second least married group is Asian males so I don’t know where you get your info from that there are more White males out of the “dating/mating scene”.
I honestly think you put white women up on a pedestal. There are far more unattractive and undesirable white females than attractive ones however due to the halo effect far too many non-white males still see these mediocre white women as a catch.
Go to any big American city and there are just many undesirable White men as there are undesirable White women. Halo effect is right! How about colored people seeing Whites in a different light for a change? That is, White folks aren’t all that special.
Don’t forget that there are also a lot of White homosexuals (eunuchs) in the population.
How about telling rice chasers that most average Asian women are not as pretty as Maggie Cheung?
“Don’t forget that there are also a lot of White homosexuals (eunuchs) in the population.”
Do you mean there is a higher percentage than of other races?
I’d say this is a given for all racial groups. There are just as many undesirable Asian men as undesirable Asian women, same for blacks as well. Not just something specific to white people.
“Go to any big American city and there are just many undesirable White men as there are undesirable White women.”
Lingyai,
I can’t see how anyone would think the suit against Yale could win. It’s sad, but it’s not Yale’s fault.
While I’m not sure there of the actual numbers (“lot more beta type WM” is a little vague, perhaps Chr.. means in absolute numbers, if not percentage-wise), my biased, unscientific observations have told me that in general, dating has gotten more difficult in recent times, both in person and online. In fact, part of the reason why I and rice-chaser dude got along was commiserating about OKCupid (yes, the source of the now infamous $24,000 disparity). It’s the popular instant-gratification culture (have you seen how people behave on “reality” TV? Sure, it’s probably exaggerated, but then again people love watching it, so it inevitably becomes an example), people who think that anything less than “perfect” is “settling” (and that any form of “settling” is bad), and PUA (which I think is more an outgrowth of prevailing culture than). All of it leads to this nuclear arms race: men become more and more aggressive, and women become more and more picky. The real losers in the war, though, are the people who actually are seeking a genuine connection with someone, and have a life to get to besides picking people up.
Erm, I think PUA is more an outgrowth of prevailing culture than *an actual new phenomenon in itself.
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